On reverse status bars and /set reverse_status_line

[Jeremy Nelson]

In EPIC4, we have /set reverse_status_line, which if ON prepends a ^V
to your status format and if OFF does not.

In EPIC5, we do not have /set reverse_status_line built in, and a ^V is
unconditionally prepended to your status format. If you want a non-reverse
status line, you need to start your status format with ^O, which cancels ^V.

In EPIC5, we have a scripted /set reverse_status_line in 'builtins' which
does the job fine, by prepending the ^O to the status format. But if the
user changes their status format, the ^O might be eliminated, and then the
status format goes back to reverse, and if the user /set's it ON, then the
script will try to remove the ^O that isn't there.

I am not in any way blaming the implementation for this problem, but I am
rather conceding that perhaps this /set is more complicated than can be
handled adequately by a script right now.

What do people feel about restoring /set reverse_status_line as a hardcoded
feature? It seemed like the right thing to do to remove it, but it's hard
to get all the edge cases correct.

Jeremy

[Zak]

* Jeremy Nelson <***@acronet.net> [2006-09-29 11:54:39 -0500]:
Hi,
|> In EPIC4, we have /set reverse_status_line, which if ON prepends a ^V
|> to your status format and if OFF does not.
|>
|> In EPIC5, we do not have /set reverse_status_line built in, and a ^V is
|> unconditionally prepended to your status format. If you want a non-reverse
|> status line, you need to start your status format with ^O, which cancels ^V.
|>
|> In EPIC5, we have a scripted /set reverse_status_line in 'builtins' which
|> does the job fine, by prepending the ^O to the status format. But if the
|> user changes their status format, the ^O might be eliminated, and then the
|> status format goes back to reverse, and if the user /set's it ON, then the
|> script will try to remove the ^O that isn't there.
|>
|> I am not in any way blaming the implementation for this problem, but I am
|> rather conceding that perhaps this /set is more complicated than can be
|> handled adequately by a script right now.
|>
|> What do people feel about restoring /set reverse_status_line as a hardcoded
|> feature? It seemed like the right thing to do to remove it, but it's hard
|> to get all the edge cases correct.
This explains some confusion i was having over epic4 v 5, even with the
scripted version it caused me some confusion, i could attempt to fix it in
my script, however i do not know how many people use this feature in their
status formats, i would prefer hardcoding if given the choice myself...

cheers

//zak

[Ben Winslow]

On Fri, 29 Sep 2006 11:54:39 -0500

Post by Jeremy Nelson
In EPIC4, we have /set reverse_status_line, which if ON prepends a ^V
to your status format and if OFF does not.
In EPIC5, we do not have /set reverse_status_line built in, and a ^V is
unconditionally prepended to your status format. If you want a non-reverse
status line, you need to start your status format with ^O, which cancels ^V.

Given that less trivial incompatible changes have been made, have you
considered simply dropping support for reverse_status_line and/or
taking out the implicit ^V to the status formats?

[Misha]

Post by Ben Winslow
Given that less trivial incompatible changes have been made, have you
considered simply dropping support for reverse_status_line and/or
taking out the implicit ^V to the status formats?

Totaly agree, why not just drop this rudiment?

[Stanislaw Halik]

Post by Misha

Post by Ben Winslow
Given that less trivial incompatible changes have been made, have you
considered simply dropping support for reverse_status_line and/or
taking out the implicit ^V to the status formats?

Totaly agree, why not just drop this rudiment?

There are users depending on EPIC being as closely compatible to ircII
as possible. Gratuitous incompatibilities shouldn't be introduced. I
believe this kind of change would be a gratuitous incompatibility. /SET
REVERSE_STATUS_LINE neither halts EPIC development nor is a considerable
code bloat.

[Jeremy Chadwick]

Post by Stanislaw Halik
There are users depending on EPIC being as closely compatible to ircII
as possible. Gratuitous incompatibilities shouldn't be introduced. I
believe this kind of change would be a gratuitous incompatibility. /SET
REVERSE_STATUS_LINE neither halts EPIC development nor is a considerable
code bloat.

My opinion goes both ways: I'd both like to see it gone, and like
to see it kept for compatibility. If I had to make a choice, I'd
vote for removing it.

As far as I'm concerned, EPIC 5 is "less compatible" with ircII
than EPIC 4 is -- and if I remember right, this has been stated by
Jeremy a couple of times. Therefore I have no qualms seeing it
removed in 5, but obviously kept in 4.

[Misha]

Post by Stanislaw Halik
There are users depending on EPIC being as closely compatible to ircII
as possible. Gratuitous incompatibilities shouldn't be introduced. I
believe this kind of change would be a gratuitous incompatibility. /SET
REVERSE_STATUS_LINE neither halts EPIC development nor is a considerable
code bloat.

Yeap, it's just like fifth leg for a chair =)

EPIC have already introduced more breakage to default ircII behaviour
than that. For example -B is now default option (and AFAIK in ircII it
is not). Reverse status line do something for the coder, which coder
must do himself, I believe so. And adding extra ^V to theirs set
status_format won't hurt anybody, but let EPIC to remove another
unused and not necessary option.

---
Entia non sunt multiplicanda sine necessitate.

[Stanislaw Halik]

Post by Misha

Post by Stanislaw Halik
There are users depending on EPIC being as closely compatible to ircII
as possible. Gratuitous incompatibilities shouldn't be introduced. I
believe this kind of change would be a gratuitous incompatibility. /SET
REVERSE_STATUS_LINE neither halts EPIC development nor is a considerable
code bloat.

Yeap, it's just like fifth leg for a chair =)
EPIC have already introduced more breakage to default ircII behaviour
than that. For example -B is now default option (and AFAIK in ircII it
is not). Reverse status line do something for the coder, which coder
must do himself, I believe so. And adding extra ^V to theirs set
status_format won't hurt anybody, but let EPIC to remove another
unused and not necessary option.

How about a compromise - having an initial ^V in the default `/set
status_user' value, but removing the /set and not prepending new values
with ^V?